Has the SHIB market dried up?

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Mr. X
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Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Mr. X »

General discussion on the SHIB market and has it dried up? Is it more alive today? Have the mostly male audience moved on? Have the mostly male audience lost their drive? Is the market too flooded? Has there been a decline in interest? Has OnlyFans taken over? Is it less feasible today to produce SHIB content vs just having an onlyfans account?
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Mr. X »

My personal view is that male "jazz" has either declined or shifted. That the driven male audience that used to exist has either gone somewhere else or lost their drive. Do sexy comics actually sell like having sexy versions of DC or Marvel characters. It seems like the SHIB market is carried more by the older generations instead of younger people. Or have the characters changed and younger people don't care about Wonder Woman and they want anime characters instead.

Also lets try and leave out any social political comments.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by scwank »

I'm sure I'm in the vast, vast minority (which makes this answer not even responsive to your question, in a way), but the content in the last couple of years mostly veered in a direction away from what interests me. Specifically, producers have largely focused on more hardcore sexual content, with a few notable exceptions. I presume they know best what sells, so if things have dried up, that's probably not why, but I wanted to put my experience out there as a data point.

(I should give a disclaimer that I don't go digging for content, so the above opinion is based on what I see publicized, which is usually from a few producers who used to be not quite as hardcore)
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by tallyho »

One article a few years back (I think DBC and ButterscotchFox were mentioned Mr X) were making the point thst with piracy producers were moving away from generic releases and looking more toward custom content, be it an open framework that different customers can pay to have their little element of kink in, in the one vid, or an outright custom video with everything g one customer wanted. So a lot of the cost is done upfront by the customs commissioners and then the impact of the piracy is lessened a bit.
I think that inevitably will mean more hard core content as that is what they paying audience tend to want and what will make the most money.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by drh1966 »

I think if you took a poll on the average age of the membership here, you'd find it skews older. If so, I believe it's because our generation (x and perhaps boomer) grew up with female peril all over tv, movies and comics. It isn't surprising that these kinks and fetishes took hold. The up and coming generation simply isn't presented with the same type of situations we were, thus no shib kink. Also, with social media and porn all over the internet, they are turned on by other things that aren't peril. I think too, that as our generation ages, there'll be a drop off in this genre. I know I'm not as active as I used to be here or elsewhere, something I've noticed about others and I buy less than ever but that's mostly because I'm not happy with most of what gets produced nowadays. Times change I guess.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Mr. X »

I think you're right drh1966 that the audience has to be exposed young to these kinks to get them hooked so later on they buy products and that the items exposed have declined. So there isn't a new crop of kinked customers.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by sugarcoater »

For the sake of context, what does SHIB stand for? I figured the first three letters stand for "Superheroines in". (I know SHIP is Superheroines in Peril, but I have no clue as to what SHIB is.)
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Mr. X »

sugarcoater wrote: 1 month ago For the sake of context, what does SHIB stand for? I figured the first three letters stand for "Superheroines in". (I know SHIP is Superheroines in Peril, but I have no clue as to what SHIB is.)
Bondage. I avoided SHIP cause SHIP is when you write fanfic to hook up two characters on a show.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Imagineer »

Batman and Wonder Woman brought superhero peril and bondage to generations of very impressionable minds through family-friendly network and syndicated television.

I doubt anything will ever replace that bubble.

I wonder, how are vampire fetishes doing these days? And is there any content coalescing around young adult dystopian scifi tropes?
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by argento »

It's true what "drh1966" says, female characters in comics have changed over the years. The comic book cartoons of the 90's, had superheroines much more sexualized than those of today. Just look at Mike Deodato's Wonder Woman or Ed Bennes' Wonder Woman. Back then, Artemis, Carol Danvers, etc. were sex bombs in danger, in fact, Carol was raped and got pregnant. But today you can read the COMIVINE forum, where some users complain if Diana's panties are smaller. The heroines have changed, but I think, that slavery is still in force, but it is not necessarily of superheroines defeated by villains.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Mr. X »

I think its also that one trigger scene that ropes someone in. We all have those. Batgirl tie up, Wonder Woman fausta. Supergirl depowered. There doesn't seem to be that in modern media for children at impressionable ages to get hooked. It might be in anime but not in western media. She Ra in my day was a tall "woman" with long legs. Today not so much. Could also be the old characters are just not popular and that there's a new crop of Jill Valentines etc.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by bushwackerbob »

drh1966 wrote: 1 month ago I think if you took a poll on the average age of the membership here, you'd find it skews older. If so, I believe it's because our generation (x and perhaps boomer) grew up with female peril all over tv, movies and comics. It isn't surprising that these kinks and fetishes took hold. The up and coming generation simply isn't presented with the same type of situations we were, thus no shib kink. Also, with social media and porn all over the internet, they are turned on by other things that aren't peril. I think too, that as our generation ages, there'll be a drop off in this genre. I know I'm not as active as I used to be here or elsewhere, something I've noticed about others and I buy less than ever but that's mostly because I'm not happy with most of what gets produced nowadays. Times change I guess.
I suspect that most of us older folks are into the softer core SHIP material and grew up with that preference of peril based SHIP based SHIP films. If you watch some of the hardcore stuff, some of which is quite good, the peril aspect is not quite as prominent and may be absent altogether in some cases. I wonder whether the peril aspect for some of these younger kiddos is not as important as it is to some of us old folks and thus the hardcore SHIP style will become more popular as time goes by and us softcore folks die off. If that is indeed the case, we may see some sort of industry wide business course correction and see more hardcore SHIP companies pop up and softcore places go away or cut down on the number of titles produced.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Visitor »

If you look at the recent superhero films and I haven't seen them all, there is rarely the heroine tied up. The Black Widow tied to a chair and interrogated was the rare example and she let it happen so she could gain information before freeing herself. Compared to the 60s and 70s TV shows that were mentioned and other adventure shows where females were regularly tied up or in peril.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Mr. X »

Visitor wrote: 1 month ago If you look at the recent superhero films and I haven't seen them all, there is rarely the heroine tied up. The Black Widow tied to a chair and interrogated was the rare example and she let it happen so she could gain information before freeing herself. Compared to the 60s and 70s TV shows that were mentioned and other adventure shows where females were regularly tied up or in peril.
True. Gigafreaks is like that as well and I don't buy their vids cause they rarely KO the girls and just tie them up. I would think a tie up would be easy filming but instead its the same fight scene then hard core sex. They did have a good wonder woman - esque video where she ends up tied up and ball gagged in the end but that's rare.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by theScribbler »

I remember when SHIB was the acronym and SHIP wasn't one yet. :lynda1:
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by drh1966 »

bushwackerbob wrote: 1 month ago I suspect that most of us older folks are into the softer core SHIP material and grew up with that preference of peril based SHIP based SHIP films. If you watch some of the hardcore stuff, some of which is quite good, the peril aspect is not quite as prominent and may be absent altogether in some cases.
I second this. I miss the peril in today's offerings. Seems producers are just trying to get to the hardcore action asap and I believe that's because of all the free porn available. Can't blame them for going where the money is but that and a few other things in my opinion are killing this genre. I miss the flavor of this genre from about 10-20 years ago. Then again, maybe I'm just getting old.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by drh1966 »

theScribbler wrote: 1 month ago I remember when SHIB was the acronym and SHIP wasn't one yet. :lynda1:
I miss the old SHIB forum. That was my first forum for this genre.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Philo Hunter »

drh1966 wrote: 1 month ago I think if you took a poll on the average age of the membership here, you'd find it skews older. If so, I believe it's because our generation (x and perhaps boomer) grew up with female peril all over tv, movies and comics. It isn't surprising that these kinks and fetishes took hold. The up and coming generation simply isn't presented with the same type of situations we were, thus no shib kink. Also, with social media and porn all over the internet, they are turned on by other things that aren't peril. I think too, that as our generation ages, there'll be a drop off in this genre. I know I'm not as active as I used to be here or elsewhere, something I've noticed about others and I buy less than ever but that's mostly because I'm not happy with most of what gets produced nowadays. Times change I guess.
I think you're pretty spot on. I'm a millennial (although at the older end of the spectrum) and the older userbase here has always been really obvious. There tends to be a VERY narrow focus here on specific characters and TV shows (a lot of which I'd never even heard of till I started hanging out here). I remember first showing up here being into a superheroine kink and initially being kind of confused by how into the "peril" aspect all the stuff here seemed to be. The superheroine media, both "regular" and smut, I had consumed most of my life up till that point had the kind of peril you all love so much as a pretty minor part.

But I think there is a problem with how you are looking at this. I think there is too much focus on narrowly defining the genre. Perhaps the answer to the original question on the post, has the SHIB market dried up, is YES but that it's the wrong question to ask. The bondage/peril aspect is a sub-genre of the superheroine kink. If that is the only part that does it for you that great, like what you like, but there is a larger kink that hits a lot of the same notes and is more the focus for others.
Mr. X wrote: 1 month ago I think its also that one trigger scene that ropes someone in. We all have those. Batgirl tie up, Wonder Woman fausta. Supergirl depowered. There doesn't seem to be that in modern media for children at impressionable ages to get hooked. It might be in anime but not in western media. She Ra in my day was a tall "woman" with long legs. Today not so much. Could also be the old characters are just not popular and that there's a new crop of Jill Valentines etc.
Mr. X wrote: 1 month ago I think you're right drh1966 that the audience has to be exposed young to these kinks to get them hooked so later on they buy products and that the items exposed have declined. So there isn't a new crop of kinked customers.
You're 100% right about that one trigger scene. I read something at one point that talked about the 5 stages of kink, and Early Encounter was (I think) stage one. It's still VERY much a thing, but as you said media has changed. It's not the same shows in the same situations, but it's STILL there and STILL driving sexuality and kinkiness. I think maybe you are just not seeing this because the kinks are slightly different then what you were/are interested in and your focus is too narrow.

My experience is that people my age and younger are WAY more into mind control and that makes sense to me because there was and is WAY more of that pop culture. It was used so many times in cartoons I watched growing up (I think one of my clearest early memories was the Mad Hatter episode of the Batman cartoon from the early 90's). The mind control kink was where I started and came to superheroine smut because when I was in my late teen's/early 20's that's where I could find that kind of smut online. I interacted a lot with the audience of the various smut I've made over the last five years or so and most of them into the superheroine stuff have come at the superhero kink from basically the same kind of starting point.
drh1966 wrote: 1 month ago Also, with social media and porn all over the internet, they are turned on by other things that aren't peril.
I wanted to come back to this because there are some aspects of this all that I think people older than me might not be seeing. There's a content feedback loop I think some of you might be able to see. I had superhero and other cartoons, and then actual comic books, as my trigger moment like so many others. But UNLIKE older generations by the time I was in my teens the internet existed. It was early days of the internet (I was a freshmen in high school when my family first got dial up AOL) and I was able to look up actual smut of those things that made me horny. For me and people my age the smut that was available was just as defining as those initial cartoons/tv shows/comics. I was never happy with just seeing a heroine tied up and threatened. Sure, it was titilating, but from basically the beginning of when I was jerking off I could SEE the "next step", the actual sex.

That access to porn, which has only grown more diverse and easily accessible with each year, is super important here. I think this is also why you see less of a fixation on specific heroine characters in newer smut stuff. The generations before me, through my eyes, seem almost comically obsessed with Wonderwoman, Catwoman, and Supergirl. I can't even begin to count how many superheroine kink stories or videos or comics that, if they aren't using the actual character, use a clear knock off. And that has always felt so boring and lazy to me. First off, there are SOOOOOOOOOOO many other characters. Second, I grew up WAY more into Marvel than DC and I think that's only gotten more pronounced with others. I feel like I had WAY more female heroines presented to me then you older guys got, and that's only increased.

Also as a quick side note there's also a feedback look some of you might not see. When I started using Daz3d to make comics it hit me early on that a lot of the things I was really into were artifacts of either the limitations or things that were easier to do while making comics with that kind of program and as hentai and just porn comics in general have become more abundant I think this has only become more pronounced. Breast growth, impregnation, costume transitions being instant and not involving slowly tearing of costumes, these are all things I and people around my age got into because it was what we were seeing in the early smut we consumed. So when we started making content we put it into what we made, mixed with new things we were able to do with the tools we were using to create smut. And the generation under me already has a lot of differences in taste that as a content creator I've had to (or chose to?) start using and adding into my work to keep their interest/meet their requests. I was never huge into anime (I think maybe I missed that boat by a few years) and only dip my toe into the non-westernized hentai stuff. But even with not directly consuming that I use a hella ton of the terminology and specific poses now. I think there's even some of this feedback look between general "mainstream" porn and kink stuff.
argento wrote: 1 month ago It's true what "drh1966" says, female characters in comics have changed over the years. The comic book cartoons of the 90's, had superheroines much more sexualized than those of today. Just look at Mike Deodato's Wonder Woman or Ed Bennes' Wonder Woman. Back then, Artemis, Carol Danvers, etc. were sex bombs in danger, in fact, Carol was raped and got pregnant.
I think this is another aspect some of you are only half seeing. Yes, comics have become less sexualized, at least in the way some of you look at it. I think most of the modern heroines are sexy as all fuck, but I don't need Carol Danvers running around in her underwear. She's sexy cause she kicks fucking ass and I find power attractive. And I don't NEED the superheroines I read in comics to be constantly sexualized to feel titilzed because you know what I can do that people older then me couldn't do as easily? I can just fucking go online and find actual porn of superheroines being fucked or just in kinky situations. I don't need my regular media consumption to be full of pseudo porn because I can get all the porn I want in the exact kink I want whenever I want. I see this division between smut/porn and regular media even heavier pronounced in people younger then me. I worry this is something people older then me can't really understand, and at times when talking to people older than me about stuff I have felt certain at least some of them can't.

With this context I think it should be pretty self evident why there has been a pretty steady move away from soft core stuff and towards hard core stuff. For me, if I want to jerk off or just feel turned on, I don't want to see some JUST cleavage and bondage, not when I can so easily got to the rest of the sexiness. I can have the stuff that in real life be just foreplay be just that and spend most of my time on actual fucking or actual BDSM stuff.
Visitor wrote: 1 month ago If you look at the recent superhero films and I haven't seen them all, there is rarely the heroine tied up. The Black Widow tied to a chair and interrogated was the rare example and she let it happen so she could gain information before freeing herself. Compared to the 60s and 70s TV shows that were mentioned and other adventure shows where females were regularly tied up or in peril.
Here's another aspect I think some of you aren't seeing, especially if your media consumption hasn't really kept up with the times. The power level of superheroines has ramped up. That stuff from the 60's/70's was almost entirely live action and heavily constrained by where special effects were and by things mostly having a TV not movie budget. Even if you aren't a comic reader and are just going by tv show and movies by the 90's you have a whole slew of superhero cartoons where the powersets/levels make the heroines from the 90's/70's look basically just like regular women. My baseline for the power a heroine had in comics and cartoons was at a place where being tied to a chair just wouldn't keep that heroine in place. DC characters have a lot of character weaknesses that are basically "here's a rock oh no you lose all your powers", and since DC stuff was most of what existed before the 90's I get that being more of a thing for older generations. But once the Marvel stuff started getting big, well, that's just not an aspect you see as much there. That's lead into this morphing of what the superheroine kink is that some of you seem to be missing or not wanting to be part of. To me, and to a ton of people my age and younger, I want to see fights like I saw in comics and cartoons and tv shows. I want to see more brutal fights, I want to see more hardcore action.

And just to be clear, I am not trying to attack any of you older guys or tell you your doing this wrong or should be into things your not into. I'm just trying to give a different generational point of view and may try and share some things I think you might not be seeing. All to try and say maybe it's only the sub-link your into is dying, but the larger superheroine kink ISN'T and is only getting more popular. The bubble HAS been replaced, it's just not covering the same exact area it used to, or maybe it's a different bubble all together that has some overlap.


One final thing that isn't a complete thought but that I wanted to share: the superheroine kink isn't just videos and never has been. I've never been super into videos for various reasons: the kinds of bodies the women in the majority of the videos is pretty limited and not what I'm into (I like thicker girls and I'm not into fake boobs) and I enjoy less reality based aspects of the kink which even when a producer can pull off tend to not be super real looking. Written stories cover different but sometimes overlapping ground than the videos. The 3D comics cover different but sometimes overlapping ground than the written stories. But those are all just pieces of the whole and sometimes it bugs me when it feels like the people who only like one piece of the pie talk like that's the ONLY piece of the pie. But maybe this is a content creator vs consumer thing? I was artistically creative/a content creator before I was smut creator and even before then wrote stories and made stuff just for myself even back when I was a teenager. Maybe this is something I can't see clearly because I've never JUST been someone who consumes smut? Like I said, this part wasn't really a complete thought...
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Mr. X »

Great reply Philo Hunter. Yes I agree it could be what we oldies consider SHIB is a narrow range. I do notice that NC sex is more popular with older people than with younger and I see a lot of adult stuff in which the female does a consenting encounter with the male. Also the "ryona(sp?)" fetish of beatings and fights. Futa is another.

As I stated I don't like the hard core in the live action material. I don't mind some nudity or a climax. That's why I prefer when Giga does their giant heroine material cause they do the more weird sex kinks like tentacles or machines. Most of their movies just end up being a porn flic.

So this is a good question, is the pool of customers drying up or are they going into different areas. Apparently anime is doing OK so it may not be drying up.

I also have to wonder about female types. I tend to like more mature women type. Others seem to like the young girl to loli types. I usually get nervous there due to the obvious age issues in the US and other countries.

Thanks for that great feedback.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by arkane »

Mr. X wrote: 1 month ago Have the mostly male audience moved on? Have the mostly male audience lost their drive? Is the market too flooded?
I am of an older generation. While I admit the Linda Carter WW was really great, I am a bondage lover and I like the superheroine in peril genre as a spinoff of that, I would have liked it even if I'd never watched the older series on TV. (So I loved the superheroine videos made by Harmony, Close-up, SHIB, Antonvideo, etc.... mostly old stuff).

Today...
While I like SHIB with Ko/Chloro etc. when I can get them, what I find today are mostly videos with different focuses: good, even exceptional production values, but often focused on aspects I am less interested in. That is superheroines fighting as an excuse to watch men beating the shit out of a woman, hardcore M/F sex (something with fake dicks, if the actress can't do it, could the producers just avoid it? it's ridiculous), sometimes fake fights that develop in lesbian sex.
So I feel I am in a niche in the niche...
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by drh1966 »

Hi Philo Hunter,

Thanks for your thoughts. I wanted to respond to a few things in your interesting post.
Philo Hunter wrote: 1 month ago There tends to be a VERY narrow focus here on specific characters and TV shows...I remember first showing up here being into a superheroine kink and initially being kind of confused by how into the "peril" aspect all the stuff here seemed to be.
This, my friend, is a result of a different generation's media experiences.
The bondage/peril aspect is a sub-genre of the superheroine kink. If that is the only part that does it for you that great, like what you like, but there is a larger kink that hits a lot of the same notes and is more the focus for others.
This is known. Mr. X's original question was is the SHIB market drying up? And based on what you wrote confirms this as your kinks, and that of other younger fans, are not so much peril or bondage driven.
My experience is that people my age and younger are WAY more into mind control and that makes sense to me because there was and is WAY more of that pop culture. The mind control kink was where I started and came to superheroine smut because when I was in my late teen's/early 20's that's where I could find that kind of smut online. I interacted a lot with the audience of the various smut I've made over the last five years or so and most of them into the superheroine stuff have come at the superhero kink from basically the same kind of starting point.
Again, generational.
...For me and people my age the smut that was available was just as defining as those initial cartoons/tv shows/comics. I was never happy with just seeing a heroine tied up and threatened. Sure, it was titilating, but from basically the beginning of when I was jerking off I could SEE the "next step", the actual sex.
Many of us have always seen the "next step". Until the internet and the videos produced in our community, we just couldn't actually view it. We had to use our imagination.
The generations before me, through my eyes, seem almost comically obsessed with Wonderwoman, Catwoman, and Supergirl. I can't even begin to count how many superheroine kink stories or videos or comics that, if they aren't using the actual character, use a clear knock off. And that has always felt so boring and lazy to me.

This is because these were the among the first superheroines available to us and appeared in live action. Again, a generational thing. The WW tv show is one of the holy grails for us peril fans, same with Batgirl and Catwoman from the Batman tv show. The Supergirl movie also ranks as a seminal moment for fans.
Yes, comics have become less sexualized, at least in the way some of you look at it. I think most of the modern heroines are sexy as all fuck, but I don't need Carol Danvers running around in her underwear. She's sexy cause she kicks fucking ass and I find power attractive.
The changes you mention are due to the changing culture towards women. Older fans grew up with WW in her classic, and impractical, costume being regularly captured and in peril. Attempts to update her are always met with resistance (remember when they put her in pants and a jacket?). Look at Black Canary; she used to run around in a corset, fishnet stockings and heeled ankle boots. Not in a long time. You grew up in a different time so your viewpoints are different. Again, generational.
I see this division between smut/porn and regular media even heavier pronounced in people younger then me. I worry this is something people older then me can't really understand, and at times when talking to people older than me about stuff I have felt certain at least some of them can't.
I don't think it comes down to "can't" as much as preference. People like what they like. Again, we grew up in a different world, not better or worse, just different.
With this context I think it should be pretty self evident why there has been a pretty steady move away from soft core stuff and towards hard core stuff. For me, if I want to jerk off or just feel turned on, I don't want to see some JUST cleavage and bondage, not when I can so easily got to the rest of the sexiness. I can have the stuff that in real life be just foreplay be just that and spend most of my time on actual fucking or actual BDSM stuff.
Thanks to the internet, a whole generation has grown up with full access to porn, something our generation didn't have. As a teen, it was a thrill to get hold of a Playboy or Penthouse magazine. Or have access to someone's video porn collection. Your generation also has different attitudes towards sex because of this. Your expectations are different. Sometimes, the idea of what can happen can be very titilating. You don't always need to have something shoved in your face. Imagination is something our generation required.
The power level of superheroines has ramped up. Even if you aren't a comic reader and are just going by tv show and movies by the 90's you have a whole slew of superhero cartoons where the powersets/levels make the heroines from the 90's/70's look basically just like regular women...That's lead into this morphing of what the superheroine kink is that some of you seem to be missing or not wanting to be part of.
Vulnerability is something that is very attractive to us older fans because the heroines weren't godlike. We could fantasize about being the villain, capturing the heroine and doing with her what we wanted. With these ramped up power levels, the heroines are basically untouchable unless you yourself are endowed with insane powers. The relatability is important. With a little planning, you could take down Lynda Carter's WW. This isn't possible with Gal Gadot's version as she's basically a god (save for the situation in WW84). As pretty as Gal is, I don't think many of us older fans fantasize about her in the same situations we do for Lynda. The warrior style costuming and power levels just don't work for many of us.

I wanted to highlight these next quotes because you kept repeating them and upon a first read of your comment, they irked me because I don't think you are seeing things from our perspective either.
...there are some aspects of this all that I think people older than me might not be seeing.
Here's another aspect I think some of you aren't seeing, especially if your media consumption hasn't really kept up with the times.
I think this is another aspect some of you are only half seeing.
And just to be clear, I am not trying to attack any of you older guys or tell you your doing this wrong or should be into things your not into. I'm just trying to give a different generational point of view and may try and share some things I think you might not be seeing.
This last quote redeemed your comments in my eyes to a certain extent. I know what you're getting at but don't forget to be open to another generation's viewpoints and experiences too.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Rembrandt36 »

There are many variables to the decline. Some would say the intro of hardcore material, but I don't think that is it. Anyone that grew up with SHiP wanted to see it go to the next step (hence Eric Stanton). Having looked at online content for the past 25 years, here are some observations of what has been done over and over, and what needs to change.

1. Every content creator has a Wonder Woman knock-off. Always dressed in red, white, and blue and always taking on some faction of the master race that wants to take over the world. We get it. Wonder Woman in bondage fighting Nazi's is hot and is your kink. But EVERYBODY does it. There is no diversity when it's the same trope over and over. The same can be said for all the Supergirl and Lara Croft knock-offs.

2. The content creator's characters are dressed like sluts, not superheroines. Where are the leggings? The fully covered bodies with masks and capes to have the costumes ripped or whipped off the heroine? When you have a thong riding right up their ass it does not say "superheroine."

3. The heroines are never written smart. Always over confident, always pompous, and always yelling out what their weakness is. I think we want to watch a smart, likeable superheroine get out of bad situations. The thrill is that she got herself in a bad situation in spite of taking precautions, not because she boldly walked through the front door and shouted "surrender!"

4. Too much girl on girl action. Hear me out. Some of it sometimes is great. However, having every female villain have the hots for the heroine and must "tame her" has been done to death. Heaven help us that there might be superheroines that aren't bi and don't enjoy getting taken and tamed.

5. There is no continuity. For creators with established characters, everything is treated as a one off. How can the viewer get invested when they know that everything gets reset to square one at the beginning of the next story? How many times have the heroines lost their secret identities? How many times have they been sold into slavery? How many times have they been raped by humans, plants, monsters, and aliens? How many times have they been knock up and it didn't matter? These are things that ongoing characters should be concerned with. You take any of the superheroines of the last three decades that have been presented in the SHiP scenarios, and 99% of the population wouldn't touch them, as they've been stretched out like the Holland Tunnel. Who knows what diseases they carry? Where is the connective tissue? If they have been sold into slavery, then have the next issue show them in that situation and how they are going to get out of it. That's the PERIL.

6. There aren't enough true supervillains. We have a lot of goons and thugs, mad doctors and women in fetishwear. Where are the supervillains that are trying to pull a heist for profit and do it with theme and a style? They are an egomaniac and dress for it. Let's see more bank heists and jewelry store knock overs. Let's see more caped and masked clods and less ski masked and sunglasses thugs. Have them take on an evil toymaker who uses toys for crime. The death trap can be the heroines are attacked and raped by plushies and toys with attachments.

7. The creators of stuff focus too much on one aspect of the fetish. How many stories and videos have we seen where too much time is spent on the milking, or knocking them out, or depowering the heroine, or knocking them up with a super soldier, etc. All of those are fun things, but the stories and videos need to be well rounded, incorporating it all. Include it all - it is all important; but have it be balanced.

8. Sure, we want the superheroines to be attractive, and the villains to be menacing. However, over the years I have seen creators go for TOO much exaggeration in there 3D characters to where they are built up too much (I've seen heroines with so much muscle and hard features that they look like men) or other characters have grossly exxagerated facial features. And why is every single guy built with a four foot dong? Shouldn't there be only one guy like that, and that's his super power? He can use it as a lasso? He can tie the heroine up with it?

9. Creators that make videos, have your models cover their tattoos with makeup - please.

10. They best story I ever read was done almost 20 years ago by the gent that started this thread - Mr. X. It was called Closed on Sunday. It was a simple story with a colorful supervillain and a nasty situation. Sometimes that's all you need.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Philo Hunter »

drh1966 wrote: 1 month ago This is known. Mr. X's original question was is the SHIB market drying up? And based on what you wrote confirms this as your kinks, and that of other younger fans, are not so much peril or bondage driven.
I'm glad I took some time to think about what you said before responding as this part of what you said took a little bit to sink in. I think came into a conversation that wasn't for me. I view the superheroine kink as a whole something I'm into with little sub-kinks being things I'm into on a sliding scale of "Yes, I want this in everything I read/watch" to "None of this, thank you very much". But that is NOT how many here on this sight view it, those little sub kinks ARE the kink for them and they have no interest in viewing their kink as part of a larger kinkiness.

Rembrant36's comment helped me see that a lot:
Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago 7. The creators of stuff focus too much on one aspect of the fetish. How many stories and videos have we seen where too much time is spent on the milking, or knocking them out, or depowering the heroine, or knocking them up with a super soldier, etc. All of those are fun things, but the stories and videos need to be well rounded, incorporating it all. Include it all - it is all important; but have it be balanced.
They are coming at this in the same way, as a larger superheroine kink, but seeing someone else say it that way... That's not why a lot of you are here for and I know that and should have been more aware of it. Things DON'T need to "incorporate it all". Every turn on is someone else turn off or just something they don't want to see/read. Everyone consumes this kind of kinky media differently, and a lot don't want that big "all in one" kind of thing.

And maybe that's something that is generational as well. I've find the younger the fans/readers I interact with are the more they are into a holistic, interconnect view of kinkiness and are more comfortable with being part of a larger kink community that is not laser focused on just one thing. Where as I've seen that the older a ran/reader is the more they are likely to be after just one specific kink/set/sex act and just want to see that and only that. This is all anecdotal so really, it doesn't mean anything, but that's what I've seen over the years I've been doing this.

So in conclusion, I am seeing this wasn't a conversation for me and although I hope what I've said has helped add to the conversation I now see a lot of those things weren't intended to be part of that discussion. I am going to respectfully step away unless someone specifically calls me back.

And here's to hoping whatever it is that gets you off gets plenty of sexy new content.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by NotUv2 »

Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month agohere are some observations of what has been done over and over, and what needs to change.
I mean, I think you can probably just expect content creators to create with what they find hottest primarily in mind.
The content creator's characters are dressed like sluts, not superheroines.
In due fairness, mainstream comics heroines are pretty frequently dressed like sluts. It's part of the kink for some people; especially if you grew up with Eighties and Nineties comics, where stripperific outfits like Psylocke's purple thong leotard were so normal that they went unremarked.

(There's a lot more noise now about the supposed desexualization of modern superheroines, but it hasn't really changed all that much in practice with the exception of a couple of characters. Wonder Woman still largely dresses as scantily as she ever did, for instance. Power Girl still has that boob window that certain people are always bitching about. Red Sonja is still defined by the teeny-weeny chainmail bikini.)
Creators that make videos, have your models cover their tattoos with makeup - please.
The overall culture has moved on from certain attitudes about tattoos. Not that you're not welcome to prefer what you prefer, but I doubt that tattoo-free models for adult content are all that easy to find or that the amount of time and foundation it would take to cover all their tattoos would be practical or even worthwhile: most of the audience just doesn't care.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by drh1966 »

Philo Hunter wrote: 1 month ago So in conclusion, I am seeing this wasn't a conversation for me and although I hope what I've said has helped add to the conversation I now see a lot of those things weren't intended to be part of that discussion. I am going to respectfully step away unless someone specifically calls me back.
I enjoyed reading your viewpoint, it was nice to get your perspective as a younger member of our forum. Thanks for posting!
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by drh1966 »

NotUv2 wrote: 1 month ago
Creators that make videos, have your models cover their tattoos with makeup - please.
The overall culture has moved on from certain attitudes about tattoos. Not that you're not welcome to prefer what you prefer, but I doubt that tattoo-free models for adult content are all that easy to find or that the amount of time and foundation it would take to cover all their tattoos would be practical or even worthwhile: most of the audience just doesn't care.
That may be true but it's still off-putting. It wasn't so bad when the girls were just getting something small on their lower back or shoulder, but so many of them now are covered in them. Tattoos are something that has been discussed in the past and there are a lot of fans here who don't like them. But I agree, finding tattoo free models in this business is probably rare.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Femina »

I think SHiB simply coincides with SHiP and thusly has been brought under blanket. SHiB is by its nature is highly specific? Like. It means 'boondage' and if all you do is tie people up, then your audience is going to be limited only to people whose thing is PURELY bondage... while SHiP can bring a wider coverage of kinks under its shade for a website such as this one here. It's sorta like... 'all superheroine bondage is peril, but not all supeheroine peril is bondage' (that's a bit simplified of course, more of a 'generalized truth')

Feel like people today have shorter attention spans. We don't obsess over ONE thing anymore so much as we obsess over a LOT of things then bounce around them like maniacs as cultivated by the pace of the modern world and the technologies that further reinforce the behavior. So I expect you'd find that the 'new blood' still appreciate SHiB... but would be bored real fast if bondage was the ONLY form of peril in the video... it's like... the difference between someone whose favorite food is Macaroni and Cheese and thus a Max&cheese dinner is sufficient... vs somebody who prefers a SIDE of Mac&Cheese with potatoe salad and a leg of chicken...

Different strokes for different folks.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by NotUv2 »

drh1966 wrote: 1 month ago
NotUv2 wrote: 1 month ago
Creators that make videos, have your models cover their tattoos with makeup - please.
The overall culture has moved on from certain attitudes about tattoos. Not that you're not welcome to prefer what you prefer, but I doubt that tattoo-free models for adult content are all that easy to find or that the amount of time and foundation it would take to cover all their tattoos would be practical or even worthwhile: most of the audience just doesn't care.
That may be true but it's still off-putting.
Evidently. To a niche minority, though. Otherwise, ink would actually have a negative impact on models' profitability. Instead, for a lot of models--even those who aren't specifically serving the "inked girl" kink niche--their ink becomes an inherent part of their visual signature and what makes them in-demand. That's why plenty of popular superheroine cosplayers have ink.

There was a time when I was one of those peeps who'd volunteer thoughts like "aren't you afraid your tattoos will spoil the flexibility of your look?" and other such nuggets of what I thought was wisdom to sex worker friends. Fortunately, I got this part of the business explained to me enough times (by very, very patient souls) that it stuck. ;)
But I agree, finding tattoo free models in this business is probably rare.
Yeah, to judge by the general drift of this thread, there isn't a large enough invested audience out there to even justify the suggested expense on dermablend (which ain't cheap by a long shot). I can see if ink or lack of it is a specific part of the creative concept (or if it's something one profoundly needs as the creator to find the content hot), but if I were investing money in creating video content I would not likely be trying to cover the performers' ink for any other reason.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by drh1966 »

God, I read through this post and I feel the same way about many of the things you pointed out.
Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago Every content creator has a Wonder Woman knock-off. Always dressed in red, white, and blue and always taking on some faction of the master race that wants to take over the world. We get it. Wonder Woman in bondage fighting Nazi's is hot and is your kink. But EVERYBODY does it. There is no diversity when it's the same trope over and over.
But isn't that the very definition of a fetish? My video collection is full of WW being chloroformed, bound, gagged, forced, etc. It's what I like. I don't need diversity in that. Change up the model, maybe change up the story a bit but as long as those basics are there and they're done well, I'm in. Again and again.
The content creator's characters are dressed like sluts, not superheroines. When you have a thong riding right up their ass it does not say "superheroine."
This irks me too. Throwing a model in a bikini or something similar isn't a costume. But as someone else pointed out, superheroines have historically never been presented in practical outfits. I know it's better now but it's still out there. It's all about keeping the male fans reading. Look what happened when they tried to put WW in a jacket and pants!
The heroines are never written smart. Always over confident, always pompous, and always yelling out what their weakness is. I think we want to watch a smart, likeable superheroine get out of bad situations.
I laughed out loud at this comment because it's so true. How is it that every bad guy/girl no matter if he/she is a super villain or a street level thug knows how to depower the heroine? As for the heroine getting out of the bad situation, I prefer seeing her get into the bad situation. I know some folks like to see a happy ending where good triumphs over evil but I don't care about that. That's not what I paid for.
Too much girl on girl action. Some of it sometimes is great. However, having every female villain have the hots for the heroine and must "tame her" has been done to death.
One of the things that has turned me off of this genre the last decade has been the proliferation of the girl on girl thing. I know I may be in the minority here, but I don't find it hot at all. It's huge out there in the mainstream and that's probably a lot of the reason why it's crept into our genre. That and the fact that a lot of the models are producing themselves and they prefer to work with their female friends in the industry which is fine and understandable except that it's not relatable to me as a guy. A male antagonist I can relate to, I can see myself in that role. The female antagonist just doesn't feel like a physical threat, maybe as the mastermind, but when it comes to carrying out the plan, it needs to be a man.
Christina has done a couple of WW vids where she's kidnapped in her hotel room by a fan at a convention but it's always a female fan. Probably 99% of CC's fanbase is male so wouldn't it make more sense that it would be a male fan who would be up to no good? It's a shame because I like the premise but it doesn't work for me with the crazy female antagonist.
There is no continuity. For creators with established characters, everything is treated as a one off. How can the viewer get invested when they know that everything gets reset to square one at the beginning of the next story? How many times have the heroines lost their secret identities? How many times have they been sold into slavery? How many times have they been raped by humans, plants, monsters, and aliens? These are things that ongoing characters should be concerned with.
I prefer one offs. I don't think continuity can work in these types of videos. As you listed, the heroines get put through a lot, and it's mostly sex based. I mean how much can someone handle both emotionally and mentally if that's their normal situation? It's not like the heroine can escape her tormentor and then just wake up the next day and go about her business like nothing happened. I don't want to see the heroine mentally traumatized, there's nothing sexy about that. But continuity would force the producers to deal with that, and that's not what this kink is about.
Creators that make videos, have your models cover their tattoos with makeup - please.
I despise the larger tattoos some of the girls have, it's off-putting. But I don't think covering up the tatts is practical and from what I've seen of the models who've attempted to cover them, it doesn't look good and you can still see them.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Rembrandt36 »

Thanks to those that have quoted my post and answered in kind. There are no clear cut answers.

I was talking about both the videos AND the 3D comics of the past 25 years. Part of the problem for someone that makes their living or their secondary living from SHiB content is piracy. I honestly wish there was a clear cut way to stop it. Paying the models, getting costumes, buying the software, setting up the 3D, doing the special effects and just making a living - what a nightmare. I wanted to get into making content, but feel I'd have to do it for the fun of it. What is the point of doing a subscription or to sell videos if it is automatically going to be pirated and torrented for free. Where's the incentive to keep going? I have the upmost respect for the content creators, and if they are producing what I like, I'll buy it.

It may come down to everything becoming custom 3D comics and custom videos. There will be a high price to pay for it, as the customer may demand that the creator cannot share the stories or videos with others as it was the customer that bought it lock, stock and barrel.

Someone was talking about the fetish and the kink of it. I completely understand having a very narrow range of kink that does it for you, over and over again. However, if you are a creator this may not be a good business model to stay that narrow. The audience may not be there strictly knocked out and carrying movies. Not enough to pay the mortgage. I think the most successful videos and 3D comics have been the ones that HAVE incorporated the variety of fetishes into a current adventure. Fighting, demasking, decostuming, knock outs, carrying, depowering, bondage, humiliation, deathtraps and sex.

As to heroines fighting villains. When I mentioned WW and Supergirl and Batgirl and such, it's the extreme narrowness of the villain line up that can get Godawful boring because it's been done to death by hundreds of creators. Wonder Woman against the 3rd Reich again? Supergirl depowered and fucked by Lex Luthor? Batgirl captured and fucked by Harley Quinn and the Joker? Please guys, these characters have a HUGE variety in their villain base; think outside the box. Have Batgirl violated by the Penguin's nose. Bang - new idea that hasn't been done.

Everybody has their limits to what they want to view. I don't have a problem with the hardcore forced sex myself. It is the clear conclusion of what's going to happen. I don't need mystery at that point. If I'm paying a subscription I want it to go from A to Z and not be coy. There are some video companies that do a VERY good job with the heroine forced sex scenarios and have sets and special effects and pretty models that can act.

My point on continuity was more for the 3D comics than it was for videos. Videos I can see as one offs. With the 3D comics there is the chance of building a mythos with the characters. More than it just being jerk off material. That's what I meant about the several stories one heroine character may appear in with recurring villains. How is it the villain isn't taunting the heroine with the facts that's she's been rode more time's than the town's bicycle? That she HAS no virtue left? That everyone on the planet knows her secret identity? That oil barons have used her as a brood mother? I'm not saying I want trauma with the heroines - not at all. But humbling and experience should be worked into their characters. Learning from their mistakes instead of being the blindly stupid arrogant bimbo AGAIN at the start of the next story.

My two cents guys. I'm not ragging, as there are a LOT of creators that have produced great SHiB material. I wish I had the time and skills to do it myself so I could cater to EXACTLY what I want to see. Don't we all?
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by five_red »

Admittedly I'm pretty much an an outsider in discussions like this. My main interest, as far as superheroines go, is transformations, and that's not something really covered well by the fetish market. Indeed, if I want to see mild mannered women turn into costumed crimefighters then it is better served by the decades worth of professional tv shows and movies from around the world that do this. But, if you'll forgive my lack of qualifications, here's a few comments from an outsiders perspective:

One: Giga videos are certainly not everyone's cup of tea, but there are produced with very high production values. (From a selfish perspective, they do include transformations in most videos, which is why I pay attention to their output, even though I have no interest in their SHIP content, which is somewhat extreme!) Because their production process is documented in blogs like Sakata Report, it is possible to get a sense of the effort they put into each video. They do location shooting (although whether they get filming permits I don't know), they employ people to design and make costumes fitted specific to each model, and they have a production schedule that spans months (it can be three or four months from the early pre-production photos going up on their BTS blog, to the actual video release.) Their content is pirated wildly, almost to the point that they seem not even bothered to get stuff taken down. The videos are entirely in Japanese, Japan's population is about a third of that of the USA, and yet... somehow... Giga manage to keep spending serious money on producing these videos. How??!!! It is something about the Japanese market that means they consume this material in greater quantities than other countries? And if that is so, why? What is it about Japan that makes superheroine fetish material so viable? Is it the Japanese people, or are Giga et al doing something that gives their videos wider appeal? Is it the more professional look of their content that has enabled them to gain a bigger market?

Two: If customs are the way forward, perhaps a crowd-sourced model might be more viable? I know some producers have already dabbled with this. Producers put out feelers for plot ideas. A script is written and made available for funders, who pay $15 (or whatever.) If the script hits its funding target, it is produced. The final product is given to funders, and then after a reasonable amount of time is sold openly for $20 (or whatever), with profits helping to support future efforts. The advantages of being a funder are (a) cheaper price; (b) influence over content, to a small degree; (c) early access. The advantage to producers are (a) bulk of costs already guaranteed before shooting begins; (b) content is less speculative because the audience has a say before filming begins; (c) allows casual buyers to sample your work, before they consider becoming funders for future projects.

Three: In order to cover as many kinks as possible, might is be possible to film short clips, on top of the regular video, that cater to specific needs. Let's be honest, if someone has an unmasking 'thing', then the first thing they will do to any video is clip out any unmasking sequences. You put out a 20 minute video, but all they are interested in is the 30 seconds when the lead character gets her mask removed. So... given that you're paying for models and equipment to film your video anyway, why not set aside some time to film 'shorts' -- 60 second clips that focus on just one kink. No story, just the pure kink. Then sell these shorts for a couple of dollars each. So alongside your main 20 minute video (which may feature a masked heroine, but no unmasking) you have three or four unmasking shorts of 60 seconds each, two or three fainting shorts, a couple of tickling shorts, or whatever. The idea is to still gain some extra 'kink revenue', without having to clutter up your main video with every type of kink.


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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by NotUv2 »

Part of the answer with Japanese porn appears to be that its profitability is driven by the female stars, who essentially act as influencers and who have dedicated fandoms that collect and trade their memorabilia. Male geeks are a lucrative part of the market, which is why GIGA superheroine videos are such a big thing, and they sell other merch beyond just the videos. Porn in the West also seems to be shifting toward an influencer-driven, performer-centric model, with the line between trades like gaming influencers on Twitch and porn performance blurring, with careers moving back and forth across it (c.f. Belle Delphine, who started out as a gaming performer and has gradually shifted toward lewd and then hardcore porn content, or former porn stars like Satine Phoenix whose career has moved in the opposite direction).

I don't know if that much helps producers in the space. It's also of limited use to the majority of performers, likely: only a minority of people who try to become influencers can actually make money at it. Also, the tech platforms driving the porn industry have been notoriously uninterested in fighting piracy, which is a major drag on profitability no matter what the model is. MindGeek (PornHub) was forced to change its tune and actually take down a bunch of pirated content only when it was targeted by insane "anti-trafficking" campaigners seeking to abolish sex work entirely.

There could be other factors driving those apparently lavish production budgets in Japan, like a darker side to the sex trade that has involved scary shit like models getting coerced into doing porn under false pretexts (in which case who knows, some of those production budgets might have been coming out of their promised pay). The yakuza is also known to be heavily involved in all elements of the commercial sex industry; I wouldn't be too surprised to learn that this was a factor in porn video production although I couldn't say about GIGA specifically, and I couldn't tell you on what actual scale those things dictate the overall economics.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by sneakly »

The only producer that I have seen that makes an effort on continuity is Bondage Cafe. They are trying to make a larger story arc. He ha access to the models models over a longer period and makes an effort to have an ongoing story. Even then, I doubt we will see new o-girl/batgirl stories because of the relatively high production costs.

I think the girl/girl nature of the stories is that a lot of women get into the fetish market to get away from straight porn. I like girl/girl, so it doesn’t really bother me. IMHO Watching Catwoman eating batgirl pussy also comes across as much less rape-y than watching Lex Luther dropping his pant to fuck an unwilling supergirl.

Giga, for what ever reason can find the resources to create awesome costume that fit and can then be readily shredded as the heroine is tortured/fucked. A lot of the US porn is barely willing to get rid of the folds.

The market drives the product. Bondage Cafe didn’t start with the Perils of O-girl. They were really well established as bondage/fetish apparel site before then, They had models that understood the attraction of the superheroine genre. And it was a labor of love, Jim Weathers wanted to make a fetishized Batman universe and he got talented models that shared the same vision or at least could see it. I wouldn’t be surprised if Giga’s success is similar. Instead of having models in one costume they will have several changes as the heroines lose their powers. They have some really witty and talented people make the monsters costumes that are more than overalls and a Halloween mask.

I assume most producers do not have access to the talent and money required for those production values. Not all models can act and a lot of producers are shooting for a day and directing a scene on that time scale, much less a compelling storyline must be really difficult.

Axel Braun does really good porn parodies, with high production values, but it is mostly straight porn. I would love to see him do a BDSM Batgirl movie, but return on investment probably may not be there and he may not have performers that are interested doing those scenes. I would love to see Sunny Lane get tied into Catwoman’s fuck machine, it I don’t think she does bondage.

Giga has been around 25+ years. I doubt their earliest stuff compares well to their current products
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Bugsy »

I am with SCWANK, just about all the new vids are porn! That holds no interest for me. I spend most of my money on NextGlobalCrisis!
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Mr. X »

Bugsy wrote: 1 month ago I am with SCWANK, just about all the new vids are porn! That holds no interest for me. I spend most of my money on NextGlobalCrisis!
This is why a lot of Giga stuff doesn't work for me. They just a porn flics with a guy who looks like a giant toaster or pirate or something. I can't tell if their market wants that or they're just doing the same thing over and over again.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by arkane »

five_red wrote: 1 month ago The videos are entirely in Japanese, Japan's population is about a third of that of the USA, and yet... somehow... Giga manage to keep spending serious money on producing these videos. How??!!! It is something about the Japanese market that means they consume this material in greater quantities than other countries? And if that is so, why? What is it about Japan that makes superheroine fetish material so viable? Is it the Japanese people, or are Giga et al doing something that gives their videos wider appeal?
......
So... given that you're paying for models and equipment to film your video anyway, why not set aside some time to film 'shorts' -- 60 second clips that focus on just one kink. No story, just the pure kink. Then sell these shorts for a couple of dollars each. So alongside your main 20 minute video (which may feature a masked heroine, but no unmasking) you have three or four unmasking shorts of 60 seconds each, two or three fainting shorts, a couple of tickling shorts, or whatever. The idea is to still gain some extra 'kink revenue', without having to clutter up your main video with every type of kink.
As for Japan, I've been there. The only country in my travels where I found in my hotel room a leaflet with all the options I could use to get porno on TV - photos of the porno movies' covers included. There's a huge interest in "commercialized" sex. Not only the act in itself but all that goes around sex. Bars where you got to talk to girls, for a fee (they pair you with the same girl if you want, again and again, you can make your illusion about having a girlfriend). Cafes where the waiters are dressed as french maids. Probably you got the idea.

I like your idea of short snippets of videos, fetish-centric. I think many customers like the whole thing, with the plot and all, but many more (me included) would like sometimes to skip that and focus on their preferred kink. A short preview of whatever is going on, even in abbreviated form with text overlaid on, and a short "after kink snippet" footage (for example, after being put to sleep, the heroine wakes up tied up). Five minutes maybe makes more sense than 60 seconds.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by arkane »

Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago here are some observations of what has been done over and over, and what needs to change.

1. Every content creator has a Wonder Woman knock-off. ....... Wonder Woman in bondage fighting Nazi's is hot and is your kink. But EVERYBODY does it. There is no diversity when it's the same trope over and over. The same can be said for all the Supergirl and Lara Croft knock-offs.
Well this is true but not 100%, some producersare trying different costumes. But what the majority of customers want?
Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago 2. The content creator's characters are dressed like sluts
Well we're talking about fetish/porn... but again, it is what the people want... or it's not?
Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago 3. The heroines are never written smart. Always over confident, always pompous....... I think we want to watch a smart, likeable superheroine get out of bad situations. The thrill is that she got herself in a bad situation in spite of taking precautions, not because she boldly walked through the front door and shouted "surrender!"
Heroine bravery/overconfidence for some (me included) is part of the fetish itself. But I agree they could try something different. Maybe it sells, who knows?
Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago 4. Too much girl on girl action. Hear me out. Some of it sometimes is great. However, having every female villain have the hots for the heroine and must "tame her" has been done to death......
While I'd like to see LESS sexual content, I agree with you 100% on this one.
Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago 5. There is no continuity. For creators with established characters, everything is treated as a one off. How can the viewer get invested when they know that everything gets reset to square one at the beginning of the next story? How many times have the heroines lost their secret identities? How many times have they been sold into slavery? How many times have they been raped by humans, plants, monsters, and aliens? How many times have they been knock up and it didn't matter? These are things that ongoing characters should be concerned with. You take any of the superheroines of the last three decades that have been presented in the SHiP scenarios, and 99% of the population wouldn't touch them, as they've been stretched out like the Holland Tunnel. Who knows what diseases they carry? Where is the connective tissue? If they have been sold into slavery, then have the next issue show them in that situation and how they are going to get out of it. That's the PERIL.
Well if a majority/a lot of videos are paid customs it's difficult to create a series with continuity. And, given the fact that fetishes in this market are very compromising, it would be off-putting to see the situations you're quoting again and again to the same heroine. You would start thinking of her as a disgusting skank. Probably, seriality can't work well with SHIP. Still, when a heroine is kidnapped or sold into slavery, I'd like to know when and how she finally gets free. Also, I'd like heroines to win in the end. Maybe after several defeats (not a whole serial, but some connected episodes with the same villain, why not?), the last word should be theirs.
Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago 6. There aren't enough true supervillains.
Probably they would cost more (decent actors, props, and costumes). However, some studios are giving us good-looking thugs and this is a good thing.
Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago 7. The creators of stuff focus too much on one aspect of the fetish.
Probably they do what a majority of people want. Still, in a 30 minutes video, a small space for a new idea could be found...
Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago 8. Sure, we want the superheroines to be attractive, and the villains to be menacing. However, over the years I have seen creators go for TOO much exaggeration.....
I agree.
Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago 9. Creators that make videos, have your models cover their tattoos with makeup - please.
I would agree but, as others have remarked, it's not so easy.
Rembrandt36 wrote: 1 month ago 10. They best story I ever read was done almost 20 years ago by the gent that started this thread - Mr. X. It was called Closed on Sunday. It was a simple story with a colorful supervillain and a nasty situation. Sometimes that's all you need.
Could you give us a link, if the thing is still online? Thank you.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by RedMountain »

For me I think the issue is there is too much of the "same" stuff coming out now. It seems like either the model pool has dwindled so only the same ones are available to do the same content for multiple producers, people are running out of ideas, or the shift to more hardcore and softcore films that ultimately wind up as "porn" is what sells. I wish we could see a better mix or return to some of the older ideas.

One of my favorite videos to this day is Lady Justice vs. The Hotel Burglars. A sexy heroine sneaking around, gets bonked on the head, the sexy thieves fondle her for a bit before tying her up(while continuing to fondle her), gag her with tape and leave her. We get some sexy squirming until she eventually frees herself and confronts one of the thieves, only to get chloroformed from behind and re-captured, tied up again, and worked over quite sexily on the bed by both thieves before she eventually resolves the situation. I wish there was more stuff that went through a bit of peril first with bondage and KOs vs the standard beat down and sex we get now.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by the123 »

i only pay to have customs made its better that way i never buy videos because it's never what you want in taste it might go well for a few minutes but then it will just be the same thing over and over but with a custom you can change everything and enjoy it more.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Dazzle1 »

RedMountain wrote: 1 month ago For me I think the issue is there is too much of the "same" stuff coming out now. It seems like either the model pool has dwindled so only the same ones are available to do the same content for multiple producers, people are running out of ideas, or the shift to more hardcore and softcore films that ultimately wind up as "porn" is what sells. I wish we could see a better mix or return to some of the older ideas.

One of my favorite videos to this day is Lady Justice vs. The Hotel Burglars. A sexy heroine sneaking around, gets bonked on the head, the sexy thieves fondle her for a bit before tying her up(while continuing to fondle her), gag her with tape and leave her. We get some sexy squirming until she eventually frees herself and confronts one of the thieves, only to get chloroformed from behind and re-captured, tied up again, and worked over quite sexily on the bed by both thieves before she eventually resolves the situation. I wish there was more stuff that went through a bit of peril first with bondage and KOs vs the standard beat down and sex we get now.
That is true, many producers have the same theme just changing the characters.

Question
If there was netflix equivilent that focused on cosplay(superheroine may be too niche) bdsm and a few other fetish would there be a market and would producers join it. Even if the per member ship cost was a lot less?
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by drh1966 »

RedMountain wrote: 1 month ago For me I think the issue is there is too much of the "same" stuff coming out now. It seems like either the model pool has dwindled so only the same ones are available to do the same content for multiple producers, people are running out of ideas, or the shift to more hardcore and softcore films that ultimately wind up as "porn" is what sells. I wish we could see a better mix or return to some of the older ideas.
I think this complaint gets recycled pretty regularly around here. Years ago we were complaining about the same motel rooms/living rooms being used, same scenarios, etc. Never ending cycle. I think there's only so much you can do in this niche. And it's fetish based so people want to see what they like. I know I do. I own several Paragon videos that are all basically the same storyline just with different models. Sure it gets boring after a while but you take a break from it and come back somewhat fresh. Doesn't always work for me but most times it does.

Even when they add new elements, those then end up being overdone. Look at the Bane character. After DKR, that villain showed up everywhere and still does. So did the backbreaker. Every. Frickin. Release. The chloroformed blow job is another, same thing. Was fresh and exciting, then overdone. What can you do?
"There's no feeling quite as exciting as that of having a helpless superheroine in your arms"
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by JWeathers »

Personally, I don’t think the market has so much “dried up”, but it’s really whether there are producers willing to outlay the cash needed to create something that isn’t just “motel cosplay porn”. It all, unfortunately comes down to piracy in the long run. At first it was people thinking it was cool to share their favorite content because it made them feel good - and now it is just folks making money sharing EVERYTHING they can lay their hands on.

Superheroine stuff - especially the type of stuff I like to produce is crazy expensive, and when there are going to be idiots that are going to instantly copy it, and try to make money off of it by putting it up on some file locker - well... there ya go.

Just my .02
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Mr. X »

JWeathers wrote: 1 week ago Personally, I don’t think the market has so much “dried up”, but it’s really whether there are producers willing to outlay the cash needed to create something that isn’t just “motel cosplay porn”. It all, unfortunately comes down to piracy in the long run. At first it was people thinking it was cool to share their favorite content because it made them feel good - and now it is just folks making money sharing EVERYTHING they can lay their hands on.

Superheroine stuff - especially the type of stuff I like to produce is crazy expensive, and when there are going to be idiots that are going to instantly copy it, and try to make money off of it by putting it up on some file locker - well... there ya go.

Just my .02
Yes a porn shot just needs a bed and a room, if that. Super heroine stuff needs sets, costumes, story line.

But I think the golden ingredient was that dry time from about 1970-2000 where boys going through puberty only had comic books and occasional movies as their source of naughty fun. No Only Fans. No unlimited porn. Unless you had a dad who got playboy you really only got your thrill from seeing powergirl defeated or Wonder Woman KOed. Starved and trickle feed is how you create a fetish person IMHO.

Now a days what do boys have for super heroine content? Hairy armpit girls? Girls with "go girl" mentality who always win. Actresses who hate their audience. No damsel or sexual content other than raw hook ups. Mediocre women in baggy costumes. Obese girls promoted as people we're supposed to like. Questionable sexuality people. constant guilting and shaming. Told not to think with their groins.

I hate to say this but the Lois on Superman is rather repugnant to me. Emaciated, abrasive, nothing sexual about her, lazy eye, no skin, no damsel of any kind. No reason I can see why a living God or even Steel would hook up with her. But she's the golden ring? I ask would anyone purchase an adult video of her vs say Erica Durance. That girl was HOT.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by argento »

I had answered your question, saying that things have changed, I learned that they ask to remove the kiss of the prince to Snow White because "it was not consensual". The opinion launched by journalists Julie Tremaine and Katie Dowd. "Snow White is asleep and therefore the kiss was not consensual. It can't be true love if only one person knows what's going on." These changes may play a role.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by bushwackerbob »

Mr. X wrote: 1 week ago
JWeathers wrote: 1 week ago Personally, I don’t think the market has so much “dried up”, but it’s really whether there are producers willing to outlay the cash needed to create something that isn’t just “motel cosplay porn”. It all, unfortunately comes down to piracy in the long run. At first it was people thinking it was cool to share their favorite content because it made them feel good - and now it is just folks making money sharing EVERYTHING they can lay their hands on.

Superheroine stuff - especially the type of stuff I like to produce is crazy expensive, and when there are going to be idiots that are going to instantly copy it, and try to make money off of it by putting it up on some file locker - well... there ya go.

Just my .02
Yes a porn shot just needs a bed and a room, if that. Super heroine stuff needs sets, costumes, story line.

But I think the golden ingredient was that dry time from about 1970-2000 where boys going through puberty only had comic books and occasional movies as their source of naughty fun. No Only Fans. No unlimited porn. Unless you had a dad who got playboy you really only got your thrill from seeing powergirl defeated or Wonder Woman KOed. Starved and trickle feed is how you create a fetish person IMHO.

Now a days what do boys have for super heroine content? Hairy armpit girls? Girls with "go girl" mentality who always win. Actresses who hate their audience. No damsel or sexual content other than raw hook ups. Mediocre women in baggy costumes. Obese girls promoted as people we're supposed to like. Questionable sexuality people. constant guilting and shaming. Told not to think with their groins.

I hate to say this but the Lois on Superman is rather repugnant to me. Emaciated, abrasive, nothing sexual about her, lazy eye, no skin, no damsel of any kind. No reason I can see why a living God or even Steel would hook up with her. But she's the golden ring? I ask would anyone purchase an adult video of her vs say Erica Durance. That girl was HOT.
If you want to figure in the time Lois and Clark met, started dating, married, had kids, and those kids are now about 16, I would say Lois should be in her early to mid 40's, a little bit past the expiration date for a typical damsel in distress. I think it's good to remember that Lois ages as a mere mortal while Superman does not. Would you rather they cast some late 20's, early 30's babe for whom nobody would buy them being the mother of teenage boys? I suspect the writers wanted a version of Lois with more gravitas, a sort of polished and poised, older and wiser, a wisdom that had come from already having had numerous adventures, a mother, not so much a babe you check out to see how much leg or cleavage she is showing this week. This Lois was not made for those of us that have this fetish for powerful women being dominated by villains, more early and younger Martha Kent rather than the babelicious Teri Hatcher or Erica Durance.
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Re: Has the SHIB market dried up?

Post by Mr. X »

bushwackerbob wrote: 1 week ago If you want to figure in the time Lois and Clark met, started dating, married, had kids, and those kids are now about 16, I would say Lois should be in her early to mid 40's, a little bit past the expiration date for a typical damsel in distress. I think it's good to remember that Lois ages as a mere mortal while Superman does not. Would you rather they cast some late 20's, early 30's babe for whom nobody would buy them being the mother of teenage boys? I suspect the writers wanted a version of Lois with more gravitas, a sort of polished and poised, older and wiser, a wisdom that had come from already having had numerous adventures, a mother, not so much a babe you check out to see how much leg or cleavage she is showing this week. This Lois was not made for those of us that have this fetish for powerful women being dominated by villains, more early and younger Martha Kent rather than the babelicious Teri Hatcher or Erica Durance.
You can have an older woman still be something to look at. In fact Durance looks good right now.

Also Lois Lane has to be SOMETHING meaning out of all the women why her. It has to be more than just some attitude. Sure you don't expect her to win beauty contests but this Lois I see nothing that would make her the desire of two alpha males, one of which is a living God. I also don't see her as some magical, nurturing person that would pull Clark away from any dark path. My guess is they will explain Superman in the other universe went bad because he had no Lois in his life to pull him back from the edge.

But I don't see that quality in this Lois. I see a nagging female who just gets mad all the time. Durance at least had that caring side to her.

The other thing is if Lois does not need to be exceptional in some way then neither do Steel or Superman. You then don't need a jacked superman or fit Steel. Even the revealed bad guy is fairly handsome and fit. Pee Wee Herman would have done just as good as the current superman actor. A short, chubby guy would have been just as good as the one playing Steel.
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