Batwoman - Season 1

[Maskripper]

Time to start a real thread for season 1!
But some introduction first:
I am waiting for such a TV show for the last 20 years.
A TV show with a masked heroine in the lead role (the only ones so far were "Black Scorpion" and "Queen of Swords").
And I LOVE her mask(s), all versions of them! Sooooo much better than 99,9% of the masks in the fetish genre.
I can't really explain HOW much this show means to me, that would take way too long.

But let's explain it like this:
I would still watch the show if the episode would be ...."Batwoman eating vegetables for 42 minutes".

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Episode 1, "Pilot", aired on Sunday, October 6th:

"General":
I have to agree to those who say that the pilot feels (a little) rushed. Personally I would/could have needed perhaps 10 or 15 more minutes.
But all in all you get a solid introduction to most characters. And in my opinion it's not needed that the pilot introduces all folks in length. After all you want also some action in it.
And it is a TV series, there will be a lot more episodes, this was only the tip...of the tip....of the iceberg ;-)

The other episodes will be different, as the starting postion is set now.
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The atmosphere is somehow dark, but I expect it to get (much?) darker in the future. But I really like it, it is much different from Supergirl and Flash. The comparison with early Arrow seasons could be right.
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The action was really good, good fights with Kate and Batwoman. But here too, future episodes will have much more in that direction.
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Alice had a really good part in this one, and I am sure she will be a great villainess in this show.
Ruby played the part pretty well, now she has some depth in the role, unlike her roles in the movies so far (that were flat characters).
And I really liked Dougray Scott as her father Jacob Kane, that will be a VERY interesting relationsship ("Jacob - Kate" and "Jacob - Batwoman").
Meagan Tandy did a good job as Sophie, I wonder how she and Kate will come along in the future.
Hard to say anything on the others (Mary, Luke) for now. They need more screentime in the next episodes.
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Flaws in the episode (nothing big, but worth mentioning):
It seems that Luke can make her a fitting suit in a matter of hours. Hmh....
She can fly with that suit ...without practice?
Alice lands a big hit on Kate with a racket(?). That isn't visible in the next scene (bruises?).

Rating "General":
A really solid first episode, and I am convinced that future episodes will be better. After all this was only the introduction!

3 out of 5
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More, incl. over 20 screenshots and my OTHER rating ;-) :
https://maskripper.org/batwoman-season-1
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DAMN, this will be HUGE!
Looking forward to next week!
As I watch the show on mondays, monday is my new favorite day of the week.
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[Visitor]

My gripe was they tried to do a more confusing version of Arrow. Too many time jumps and not enough explanation of what was happening before jumping to the next. It really should have been a two hour pilot with more time given to major developments or bringing in less information in a one hour pilot.

Traumatic event as a child with the car wreck and seeing Batman.
Training with the military to have the skills to join her father.
Training with unnamed old guy to have the skills now that she isn't in the military.
Past lesbian relationship that got her out of the military and now starting it up again.
Batman's disappearance 3 years ago and what has taken the void since then:
Various people have pretended to be Batman and died from their incompetence.
Dismissing the new Batman as another pretender by Jacob Kane.
Finding out that Bruce Wayne was Batman by his cousin Kate Kane and changing everything she had thought had happened.
Luke is keeping the Batman secret and knows more than he is telling.
Finding out her father didn't want Kate to go into the family business of Crow so she becomes Batwoman instead.
New major villain in Alice and how she fits in with the Kane family. Revealed too soon and changes the whole dynamic with Batwoman before it really started.

[Maskripper]

My gripe was they tried to do a more confusing version of Arrow. Too many time jumps and not enough explanation of what was happening before jumping to the next. It really should have been a two hour pilot with more time given to major developments or bringing in less information in a one hour pilot.

Traumatic event as a child with the car wreck and seeing Batman.
Training with the military to have the skills to join her father.
Training with unnamed old guy to have the skills now that she isn't in the military.
Past lesbian relationship that got her out of the military and now starting it up again.
Batman's disappearance 3 years ago and what has taken the void since then:
Various people have pretended to be Batman and died from their incompetence.
Dismissing the new Batman as another pretender by Jacob Kane.
Finding out that Bruce Wayne was Batman by his cousin Kate Kane and changing everything she had thought had happened.
Luke is keeping the Batman secret and knows more than he is telling.
Finding out her father didn't want Kate to go into the family business of Crow so she becomes Batwoman instead.
New major villain in Alice and how she fits in with the Kane family. Revealed too soon and changes the whole dynamic with Batwoman before it really started.

Well, I basically agree that there are a lot of ?-marks left.
But that isn't a bad thing for me.
It was only one episode of (hopefully) 21/22 episodes in this season. There is a lot of time to answer these question marks.
From what I heard they will use flashbacks like in Arrow. To what extent.... they haven't revealed yet.
But we will see that pretty soon.

Spoiler

Batwoman has now 2 episodes left that are settled BEFORE the Elseworlds crossover from last year.

Especially in these two episodes I hope they will spotlight some of those ?.

[AnastasiaPierce]

I watched it last night and thought it was so so. Ruby Rose is way too butch for me and so tiny, she is shorter than any character and doesn't give me the impression she can kick ass.
I will watch another two episodes. Maybe it gets better. Otherwise I will stop watching.
Kendra James is a much better BATWOMAN!

[batgirl1969]

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[Abductorenmadrid]

OK - so I watched this just now.

Firstly, this is not as bad as I was expecting considering the comments I had seen here. Yes, there is a bit of jumpiness and I think the end of episode revelation was oddly timed. Is Alice going to be a quickly resolved villain then? Or is she going to be part of a longer season length arc? Because that plot revelation certainly seemed to be more inline with the former, and not the latter. So, with that then being the pitfalls of trying to do too much in one go what did they do right?

Well, I liked the aesthetic. The colour palette of the world and the skyline is distinctly different from say, National City and you certainly have that feeling of glitz and glamour clinging on to the last good bits of city that is looking a little tatty. The fight scenes were good too, with a physicality and style that went with how I thought it should be. Supergirl fights are often a bit "Swishy and swoooshy" but this was bone snapping, ligament tearing Bat fightingly-good. And then there is Alice. Rachel Skarsten I thought gave a solid performance, not show stealing great, but certainly good. And I liked her dialogue. That little ditty she delivers up on the building site, it was good right? Not OTT, not corny, just beautifully sinister, these little moments make for a good villain. And the barrel predicament, was a little different.

So yeah, I thought this wasn't bad at all and I want to see more.

[batgirl1969]

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[shevek]

Lesbians, motorcycles, tight black rubber, rope bondage and paddle abuse all in the first episode...hell yes This show rocks!!!! I officially LOVE this new series and I can't wait to see more character development and how Kate, the gorgeous sexy little kat that she is handles her self and her relationships!! plus the bat equipmemt

Have to disagree somewhat: so many plot holes, so many lazy conveniences, and so many way-too-early reveals (especially the Alice thing). The whole thing is kind of a mess. And it's got an absolutely dismal 8% on Rotten Tomatoes vs 72% for the media shills. One rarely sees a more disparate score than that.

But you're right, batgirl1969, there is a good amount of kinkiness and BDSM reference, so maybe that will save it from week to week. I kind of wish a comic book writer like Stjepan Sejic (Sunstone, the new Harleen) was writing it so the sexy parts would kick it up a few notches. But it's not an R show on HBO so that's unlikely to happen.

Gotta admit, the actress playing Sophie (Meagan Tandy) is gorgeous (like on the level of Candace Patton from Flash) and the brief moment when their eyes meet while Kate's in the mask, on that mattress thing, was steamy. The mask looks rather terrible without the wig, though. The sooner Ruby Rose femmes it up and gets the red hair and the bright-red lips (a la the comics) the better. And yes, she is *tiny*. Like various Youtube critics have been saying, you really have to suspend disbelief to accept that a 110-pound woman can kick everyone's ass. We'll eventually get used to the idea, I suppose.

Here's a surprising fact: the actress who now plays Alice (Rachel Skarsten) played Black Canary (Dinah Lance) in the 2002 Birds of Prey TV series which I'm sure many people on this forum have taken a gander at. Black Canary was portrayed as a teen in that show, so Skarsten is still fairly chipper at 34.
Definitely want Alice to last a while in this season.

[Dogfish]

Yes. It is the professional reviewers who are giving scores in bad faith not the weirdos on the Internet.

[Maskripper]

And it's got an absolutely dismal 8% on Rotten Tomatoes vs 72% for the media shills. One rarely sees a more disparate score than that.

Don't fall for the trolls. Hordes of trolls have targeted this show to spill their hate on it. If they rate 1 out of 10 on IMDB like they do (over 50% of the votes) it is clearly that these are trolls or people who can't rate things (or ...both). You don't have to love or like the pilot. But anything below...let's say a 3 out of 10 is ....ridiculous.

The mask looks rather terrible without the wig, though. The sooner Ruby Rose femmes it up and gets the red hair and the bright-red lips (a la the comics) the better.

Don't you worry, she will have the real Batwoman cowl in

Spoiler

episode 3.

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*EDIT*
And a set picture with the unmasked Batwoman and Alex....especially for Batgirl1969:



Looking forward to see how they play together in the crossover. :-)

[shevek]

Have to disagree somewhat: so many plot holes, so many lazy conveniences, and so many way-too-early reveals (especially the Alice thing). The whole thing is kind of a mess. And it's got an absolutely dismal 8% on Rotten Tomatoes vs 72% for the media shills. One rarely sees a more disparate score than that.

Don't fall for the trolls. Hordes of trolls have targeted this show to spill their hate on it. If they rate 1 out of 10 on IMDB like they do (over 50% of the votes) it is clearly that these are trolls or people who can't rate things (or ...both). You don't have to love or like the pilot. But anything below...let's say a 3 out of 10 is ....ridiculous.

The mask looks rather terrible without the wig, though. The sooner Ruby Rose femmes it up and gets the red hair and the bright-red lips (a la the comics) the better.

Don't you worry, she will have the real Batwoman cowl in

Spoiler

episode 3.

P.S.: I put the "episode x" in spoilers. But I don't see it marked as a spoiler. Can you guys see that "normally"?

Oh, I'm not saying that there aren't trolls after this show. There certainly are. But you also have to look at the numbers: the 1.8 million who purportedly watched this premiere is the lowest number of viewers for the debut episode of any CW superhero show, including Black Lightning (which was over 2 million).

And when you compare the Batwoman premiere to many of the non-CW comic book shows that have made an impact (and I've seen all of them) such as The Boys, Umbrella Academy, Swamp Thing and Titans, the Batwoman premiere is worse than all of them. Even Doom Patrol is better, at least because of its sheer weirdness. I'm not saying don't give Batwoman a chance, I'm saying that it'd better improve quickly if it wants to have a chance at all.

Guess we'll see.

[Maskripper]

Quote function doesn't work now... so, I will improvise:
^ shevek: "But you also have to look at the numbers: the 1.8 million who purportedly watched this premiere is the
lowest number of viewers for the debut episode of any CW superhero show, including Black Lightning (which was over 2 million). "

There are more and more shows every year, the general numbers of nearly every show are going each year.
So you can't really compare ratings from this year with ratings from some years ago.
And also the streaming are taking a bigger part of the cake each year.
These numbers aren't visible, I guess only the CW have those.

What will be really interesting is for me how the numbers for this show will continue, especially compared
to the other "hero" shows from the CW in THIS TV season.
If the show stays above Black Lightning and LOT, which I are pretty certain ...I'm confident.
Arrow and Supergirl will be interesting comparisons as well.
I don't think they will top Flash, as it was the show with the biggest audience lately.

[theScribbler]

Is the formatting messed up in this thread for everyone or just me?

I posted my take in the other thread. Thought I'd try adding something here, but not sure what.
Expected the actresses to be pretty. Didn't expect not to perceive any hotness at all. I blame the director and wardrobe.
This Gotham is a lame attempt at sorta Nolan imitating on CW budget, with surprisingly bad production design. FOX's Gotham was also lame, but had better production design and some hot actresses actually looking hot on it.

I thought the Batcave was under the mansion, not in the office building.

Elevator? And slow one at that! Where's the Batpole?

Spoiler

Code: Select all

 SPOILDER in here. couldn't get spoiler tag to work so i tried code instead...................      Car crash... on bridge... falls into the water. Just like on Smallville Pilot. Alice throws knifes like Arrow shoots arrows and just as fast. A typical Berlanti DEO like control center. Nothing new. Nothing at all. Same ole same ole ad nauseum. So many tropes done before and done better before.

Premiere left me with no excitement to see episode two. Not 'I can't wait to see it.' More like 'I don't care if I see it.'

But probably I'll watch ep 2, on rewind, so I can fast-forward through most of it. Not gonna waste an hour, I'll waste 1/2 hour.

[batgirl1969]

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[Visitor]

Depending upon the Batman version, additional Bat cave support areas were added beneath Wayne corporate headquarters and other locations in Gotham so Batman could have access to equipment without returning to Wayne Manor and the main Bat cave. Although the elevator was probably added as a joke compared to all the other ones in the building.

Bruce Wayne's password for a highly important and secure system being Alfred was a laugh and probably a reference to Alfred's password in "Batman and Robin."

[Dogfish]

The complaints about lack of hotness are a bit derpy in my opinion. It's like, think about the original Wonder Woman TV show, there's like a tiny number of iconic scenes in that, out of however many episodes. Don't expect every episode to be a porn movie and maybe the show will meet your expectations better. Whole lot of people seem to be expecting something that it was never going to be.

As for the trolls trying to review bomb it, that's just sad. I mean I get they hate women and they hate female led shows and they probably hate everything else too, but rudimentary self interest should kick in at some point. Even the sweatiest Incel chud should recognise that TV shows about hot lesbian superheroes are a universally good thing. Like, that should transcend political boundaries, it's something everybody can enjoy. It's in everybody's best interests that this show do well, so we can get like two or three entire TV channels dedicated to this kind of show.

[Dazzle1]

A few questions for fans(I ack the Arrowverse is not for me)

Do you think it is wise how the producer or writer on doing the male/Bruce Wayne bashing that we see in the promos

Why would they put someone as polarizing and bluntly ugly as Rachel Maddow on the show. It is saying screw you to a large segment of the country.

[Dogfish]

Isn't Maddow just providing a newscasters voice? Seems fair enough.

[batgirl1969]

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[Maskripper]

Episode 2 - The Rabbit Hole

"General":
After the little rushed pilot episode this one feels like a "normal" episode. There are still some flashbacks to fill in some of the many gaps that the first episode left open. I am pretty sure that we will get more of them to learn more about the past of the figures, especially Kate's.
The episode is centered around the relationsship between Kate and Alice/Beth and establishes the relationsship. Kate wants to be sure if Alice is her long lost sister while the Crows target Alice and want to put her down for good.
All in all I really like the episode. As expected now the story really gets going. The action between Kate and Alice is well done and shows this pretty unique setting. Kate wants to save her sister while the "Batwoman part" in her wants to put Alice down.
There are several highlights for me in this episode.

1) Kate meets Alice near their old favorite place. Great atmosphere and interesting dialoges!
2) Chuck visits Mary in a really good "Shining" homage. The only thing that was missing is him saying "Here is....CHUCK(Y)!" with his head in the damaged door ;-)

Spoiler

3) Batwoman saves Alice from drowning ...and thereby Alice finds out who is hiding under that mask (very close eye contact). Cool Gadgets!
4) Kate finds a hint that Alice knows now that she is Batwoman. A cool bat and great reference to the comics ("You have your fathers eyes")
5) The revealtion at the end (Catherine). That will get interesting! What is she up to?

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Like in the first episode I really enjoy the score! Helps really the push the dark atmosphere.

>>> Rating "General:" <<<

(4 out of 5)

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Conclusion:
>>> Alice and Kate/Batwoman...that is and will be a great duel. A really GOOD episode! <<<

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More details (incl. "Mask rating") and screenshots here:
https://maskripper.org/batwoman-season- ... tober-13th

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Trailer for episode 3 (with the FINAL BATWOMAN costume :-) ):


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[Dogfish]

Yeah I liked this one too. The show moves fast. I'm still kind of used to Netflix shows that took thirteen episodes to go nowhere so this is exhausting.

If this was a Netflix series it would have taken an entire season to cover the story in the first two episodes, and it'd be cancelled by now.

[Visitor]

The second episode was better because it focused on telling mostly one storyline where the flashbacks filled in why people were acting the way they were. Plus you have the twist of whether Alice is Beth because she knows things only the Kanes should know or as she put it to Kate that she read about in a news story. After all how do you trust a crazy person playing games.

More episodes at this pace and the show will get better. Now if they could only light the sets like on the Flash instead of Arrow.

[Maskripper]

Well, since quoting doesn't seem to work in this thread right now:

@Dogfish:
It is pretty fast paced. But I guess it has (in parts) to do with the thing that Batwoman has to be an "established" heroine by episode 4 (since the crossover from last year is timed between episodes 3 and 4)

@ Visitor:
"light the sets like on Flash instead of Arrow"....what do you mean by that?
That it should be less dark? Because it fits good to Gotham and this show.
Or do you mean something else?
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Batwoman and Supergirl on set of the upcoming crossover (Twitter):



Damn, looking forward to know who plays together with who and why in that event.

[Visitor]

I meant when you have a fight scene don't do it on a set with so little lighting you can barely see anyone fighting. I get Gotham is a dark place and the color palette for the scenes is pretty much black and grey with the sole colors being Alice in white and eventually Batwoman getting some red. Flash and Supergirl are brightly lit sets for most of the fight scenes so you can see what's happening.

An example of what I mean was last night on the season premier episode of Arrow, two men in Arrow costumes with one dark green and the other black were fighting. After a few changes in camera angle you couldn't tell which was which until the end with the unmasking.

The second episode of Batwoman had dark alley fights where one could barely see Batwoman. The fight in the clinic was better where you could see the action.

[Maskripper]

^ Maybe your TV setting is just too dark ;-)
Ok, I get what you mean, but it's ok for me the way it is (or the way it looks for me on my TV).
This reminds me a little about that Game of Thrones episodes (S8E3?) with the battle in the night where many complained it was way too dark. I don't agree on that.
If it is night, it is ok if some things stay in the shadows.

[Dogfish]

It's a Bat thing as well, it's all supposed to be dark. Batman/Batwoman are supposed to scare people by popping up in the dark as much as batter them. That's ought to be reflected in how they are shot.

[Dogfish]

Watched the latest episode and okay so it's now finally, y'know, started what with the proper suit and stuff.

But here's the thing, like, Batman disappears for three years. Then a new Bat hero appears, and it's a woman with this bright red wig. I mean, if you're a citizen of Gotham, and it's 2019, surely the first instinct is to think somebody just started living their truth. Like, I'd just be thinking, "Good for Batsy, is she going with female pronouns or...?"

What I mean is, I feel like they maybe should have had both the Bats out there at the same time, otherwise peoples gonna wonder.

[DrDominator9]

This third show last night was good and the series is already getting better. Plots are intriguing and the motivations are clarifying for all the characters. Decent action too. I was worried with the pilot but the show's settled down and is better for it.

[Visitor]

Better writing and keeping the episode to a main plot and continuing storyline that doesn't interfere with the episode's main villain.

Curious and curiouser, "Wearing a red wig and they call me the crazy one." - Alice. Still stealing the show.

Edit - Better lighting for the fights this episode where even at night the rooftop fight had enough set lighting so you could see Batwoman fighting Tommy with plenty of disappearing in shadows for the mystique and mood.

[Maskripper]

Episode 3, ("Down, Down, Down")

"General":
Episode 3 conlcudes the end of the beginning. Now, it would say that the first 3 episodes are the complete pilot, the introduction. The plane was still rolling on the runway. Now, after episode 3....Batwoman is finally there in the open, no one will be thinking anymore that Batman has returned. Things will change from now on. The plane is now airborne....and I'm excited as hell about it!
My highlights from this episode:
1 - Alice! Wow, I must say she is a great, mad, creepy, sometimes funny villainess! The figure is well written and Rachel Skarsten does a fantastic job playing her. And this 2 front "war" with Alice VS Batwoman and Alice VS Kate is a great settting. Batwoman can't ever feel save because Alice knows her secret identity. I wonder how that will play out in the future.
Three scenes in particular were really good. The scene with the Batsignal (the dynamic between Kate and Alice), the scene with the cello and Jacob (atmosphere!)and the rooftop with the unmasked Batwoman (now the battle between them will really start).
2 - the Chicago scenery! Just like in the past (Nolan's Batman movies), it delivers a wonderful look posing as Gotham
3 - Batwoman has arrived! As Luke spray-painted the red logo on the suit and Kate put on the new cowl and the iconic red wig.....I guess I smiled like a mad man
There she...this is the birth of the Batwoman!
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I'm curious to see more of Katherine...so far it is all very mysterious. What is she up to? What does these cards from Alice mean?
Mary is getting more and more sympathic to me. She really wants to help the people and isn't the flat, selfish, party mouse she plays during the day.
Luke is getting along better now with Kate, their relationsship is getting more interesting. Now it's time that we get to know him better....because this far, we know nearly nothing about him besides that he takes care of Batman's stuff.
I wasn't really thrilled about Thomas "Tommy" Elliot, that character needs more backstory in my opinion. They provided some info, but as he is a rather big Batman villain, he should have more episodes. Don't know if he will show up in more episodes.
The "railgun" was a nice gadget, but even as Batwomans "and" Batmans suit are bulletproof, the gun is only nice to have. After all, the lower half of the face isn't covered, and if you would unmask the wearer...the whole face would be vulnerable (assuming the cowl is bulletproof too, which I guess it is).
My only -not really big- "complain" about this episode is the amount of action. It has a little too few of it. Practically only the fight with Batwoman VS Tommy and the elevator scenes provided action.
But the time was needed for completing the "introduction", I am sure there will be more in the next one(s).

>>> Rating "General:" <<<


(4.5 out 5, incl. a little "the birth of Batwoman" Bonus)
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>>> Rating "Mask": <<<

(2.5 out of 5)

...details on my blog:
https://maskripper.org/batwoman-season- ... tober-20th
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Trailer for Episode 4:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elIJjfXgqfA

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Is it next Monday already? No? DAMN!
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[batgirl1969]

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[Abductorenmadrid]

OMG!! are my eyes decieving me???? Is she in bed naked with a hot blonde??? holy 69 batman, next week is going to be awesome!!

Ah yes, the most delightful member of the bar staff, Reagan. Her sixth sense about people might make for a really good (if yet unwitting) ally for Batwoman... but will she figure out Kate's secret first? Time will tell!

[brdiy]

Always a delight to see the hot Brianne Howey in any show. Now if only the show could find a way to get her into a tight situation, a tight costume or both.

[RedMountain]

My gripe was they tried to do a more confusing version of Arrow. Too many time jumps and not enough explanation of what was happening before jumping to the next. It really should have been a two hour pilot with more time given to major developments or bringing in less information in a one hour pilot.

Traumatic event as a child with the car wreck and seeing Batman.
Training with the military to have the skills to join her father.
Training with unnamed old guy to have the skills now that she isn't in the military.
Past lesbian relationship that got her out of the military and now starting it up again.
Batman's disappearance 3 years ago and what has taken the void since then:
Various people have pretended to be Batman and died from their incompetence.
Dismissing the new Batman as another pretender by Jacob Kane.
Finding out that Bruce Wayne was Batman by his cousin Kate Kane and changing everything she had thought had happened.
Luke is keeping the Batman secret and knows more than he is telling.
Finding out her father didn't want Kate to go into the family business of Crow so she becomes Batwoman instead.
New major villain in Alice and how she fits in with the Kane family. Revealed too soon and changes the whole dynamic with Batwoman before it really started.

I mean if you even remotely followed her comic, you'd know about Alice ahead of time and would have made the connection as soon as she was mentioned as a villain on the show.

[Maskripper]

Some screenshots from ep3 (more on my blog):


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And a little recommendation, if you want a detailed review (podcast - around 80 minutes) of the latest episode, check out:
https://twitter.com/batwomantvtalk
(they will release their episodes on tuesdays)

The 2 hosts analyse scene for scene...and they are doing a pretty good job!
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[shevek]

Just watched the third episode. Here are some problems:

-The actor playing Luke Fox flubs the word electromagnetism, pronouncing it "electromagnezzism". They were too lazy to do another take?

- The actress playing Reagan the bartender also partially flubs her line, "a verbal carwash of veiled misogyny." After several tries, I found it hard to tell whether she was saying "verbal" or "veritable". And more to the point, it's a writer problem as well. To demonstrate that Tommy's a horrible sexist, why not SHOW rather tell? Have him treat a woman at the party like dirt. Then, as viewers, we'll harbor antipathy towards the Hush character, and not feel that we've just been lectured by an artificially inserted tagline. Again. But of course (attn batgirl1969) Kate Kane immediately goes to bed with the one beautiful woman in Gotham City who shares her perspective on the patriarchy.

- I question the choice that changed the Hush character Tommy from a surgeon to a real estate developer, but that is already something that Youtube channels have covered a bit.
It gives Hush a sense of one-note disposability he shouldn't have - in the various Batman comic appearances, he was always formidable and devious (and covered with bandages).

- The whole episode hinges around Tommy being careless enough to leave the door to his office unlocked while inspecting the railgun for the nonexistent GPS tracker. If his building is so formidable and his plan so genius, why would he let anyone (Kate) stroll right into his office, and why isn't there any security to stop her?

- The consistent inability to believe that Alice could be Beth makes Commander Kane one of most stubborn, hard-headed characters I've ever seen.
Is a smart police commander who runs a crack security force really that dense?

- Not at all sure what the purpose is for the character of Mary Hamilton. I get that Kate needs a friend and ally, but the portrayal seems out of place. Does a brilliant medical mind really have to hide her skills and act like a socialite ditz just because she's a woman? That sounds more like a 1960s premise. It doesn't seem very Current Year feminist.

- Maskripper obviously disagrees, and I respect his enthusiasm, but to me, the very first time that we see Batwoman in the suit with the red wig is not an impressive one. The closeup on her face made her look haggard, with worry wrinkles that made her seem like a woman in her late 40s. At least they had the sense to put in the line "sexier and curvier" but if she's going to live up to that, they should depict her as such. Giving her the kind of pale makeup that she had in the comics might help a bit.

My favorite part was the sequence where she spraypainted the Bat-Logo red and put on the various new parts of the suit. They should have revealed hints of the red wig at that point.

Still watching this regardless. Looking forward to the Kate/Reagan bed scene. I'd rather see this show for myself than rely on others to merely lambaste it for me. There's more to process than the dismissive critics are willing to admit, although there's plenty of formula and stumbling-about as well.

[Maskripper]

@ shevek:
Normally I am easily entertained (if certain ingredients are in the mix) and tend to overlook many, mostly the smaller flaws.
- Personally I would file your first 2 problems under nitpicking ;-)
---> Hush/Tommy Elliot: Well, yeah, I was surprised too he wasn't a surgeon in the show. At least it wasn't mentioned. Maybe the real estate thing is just a hobby...
However he wasn't supposed be be Hush already. In the show he isn't already the villain he later becomes in the comics. The bandages will come in the future. Don't know if he will return to the show, that wasn't mentioned so far.
----> Tommy in his office: Yeah, there should have been some security...but perhaps Kate knocked them out? We can only speculate.
----> Jacob Kane: Well, I would say it's rather that he doesn't WANT that Alice is Beth. Alice is a monster and perhaps he rather want to believe Beth is dead than now being Alice. Hard to tell.
----> Mary Hamilton: Perhaps she hides her abilities because of her parents. I can't tell what Katherine is really up to, she wants to get rid of Alice but I guess after all she is more like a villainess with some dark secrets. I expect more to come in that direction. And I think that Mary don't want her father to be worried because of her. The secret clinic in the bad part of town wouldn't be something he or Katherine would approve (as it is dangerous).

What scenes did you enjoy besides Batwoman gearing up?
What do you think of Alice and her relationsship to Kate/Batwoman?
What do you expect from the next episode? (trailer)
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[shevek]

@ shevek:
----> Tommy in his office: Yeah, there should have been some security...but perhaps Kate knocked them out? We can only speculate.
----> Jacob Kane: Well, I would say it's rather that he doesn't WANT that Alice is Beth.

What scenes did you enjoy besides Batwoman gearing up?
What do you think of Alice and her relationsship to Kate/Batwoman?
What do you expect from the next episode? (trailer)
-

The Tommy's office thing is a plot hole. It should have been demonstrated how she was able to get in there to see him holding the railgun.

As for Jacob, by now, as a seasoned cop, he's been shown far too much evidence that Alice is Beth for it be circumstantial. And in the comics, the very first time he sees Alice, he already recognizes her as Beth. So you're right, he must be really deep in denial (not the river in Egypt). That's why it seems hard to believe.

Other scenes I enjoyed? Mainly the action parts. There's a weird dissonance, though, between how difficult the fight seems between Tommy and Batwoman, and how hard it is for her pull herself up through the hole in the elevator shaft wall...and then how perfectly she can aim her weapons and how easily one thin grappler-hook cable can suspend an entire elevator car when several thicker cables are usually needed to do so. But that's the usual suspension of belief sometimes needed to get through a superhero show.

I think Alice and Kate being tacit 'allies' (Kate gives her so many passes after being initially beaten up with the paddle. OK, you killed a bunch of people, then you killed our dad's guard, but if you kill just one more time....) is very rushed this early on. In the comics, the twins don't really fight on the same side until several stories into Alice's saga when she becomes the vigilante Red Alice. At this point in the story, both Jacob and Kate should really want to just capture Alice, secure her, and get her the help she needs, but they're both making excuse after excuse which keeps her on the loose, and the excuses don't make much sense. I get that they have to do that to prolong Alice's status as the season's overall supposed Big Bad, but the premise is wearing thin.

Next episode: Looking forward to Magpie, whom I've always enjoyed as the quirky kooky goth chick. Her introduction in the Animated Series was a sexy interaction with Batman. Her appearance in Gotham was brief (she was killed within one episode) and the actress who played her wasn't particularly good-looking, relying on just acting crazy to get her part across. Her latest comic book appearance in Batgirl was worse - she was positively ugly. So over time, she's looked worse and worse. From the trailer, this version by Rachel Matthews looks like it will be a considerable improvement. Matthews has little major acting experience (basically all she's done were the recent Happy Death Day movies, which were a cult phenomenon) so we'll have to see how she pulls it off.

There is a major character in the Batwoman mythos (nascent as it still is) whom I'm wondering when we will begin to see: Bette Kane as Flamebird, or more recently, Hawkfire. In the comics, her character has been around almost as long as Kathy Kane, and *much longer* than the revamped Batwoman version. And Bette's costume has always been very fun and gorgeous, going back to West Coast Titans. Plus she is a blonde bombshell (alert: batgirl1969) which would add some serious spice to the otherwise dark proceedings. So, personally, I'm wondering whether this 'Reagan' woman is going to turn out to be some version of Flamebird/Hawkfire in the show. Or if she'll just be a one-or-two episode fling for Kate to take her mind off Sophie.
Either way I would love to see a credible version of this character appear in Season 1.

[Visitor]

Just watched the third episode. Here are some problems:

-The actor playing Luke Fox flubs the word electromagnetism, pronouncing it "electromagnezzism". They were too lazy to do another take?

- The actress playing Reagan the bartender also partially flubs her line, "a verbal carwash of veiled misogyny." After several tries, I found it hard to tell whether she was saying "verbal" or "veritable". And more to the point, it's a writer problem as well. To demonstrate that Tommy's a horrible sexist, why not SHOW rather tell? Have him treat a woman at the party like dirt. Then, as viewers, we'll harbor antipathy towards the Hush character, and not feel that we've just been lectured by an artificially inserted tagline. Again. But of course (attn batgirl1969) Kate Kane immediately goes to bed with the one beautiful woman in Gotham City who shares her perspective on the patriarchy.

This is poor editing since it's a standard practice, looping, to record dialogue in a sound booth with the actor seeing the scene to have a dialogue track that can replace the original version. This allows the editor to adjust the dialogue sound level over the background noise to make sure it can be heard. You can't do this with a live studio audience production, but for this type of show there is no reason that flubs weren't fixed.

Other scenes I enjoyed? Mainly the action parts. There's a weird dissonance, though, between how difficult the fight seems between Tommy and Batwoman, and how hard it is for her pull herself up through the hole in the elevator shaft wall...and then how perfectly she can aim her weapons and how easily one thin grappler-hook cable can suspend an entire elevator car when several thicker cables are usually needed to do so. But that's the usual suspension of belief sometimes needed to get through a superhero show.

In episode 2, Kate read Batman's account of the car accident and how strong his grappler-hook cable was able to support back then. While elevator cables need to support the greater weight of maximum passenger capacity, usually 2000 pounds, with a safety margin. Plus the elevator cables have to last for years before failing compared to replacing Batman's equipment.

One time I was helping to move some granite blocks using an elevator and we had the question on whether the elevator could handle the load. Not want to risk ourselves since we didn't know the cargo weight, one of us slipped a hand inside to push the button while we took the stairs.

[Dazzle1]

The Bette Kane character really doesn't fit with the modern Batwoman

When they introduced her as the original Batwoman's side kick it was mostly as a comic relief and a puppy madly in love with the original Robin

than they reintroduced her when the Teen Titans had 40 members, this was pre Raven/Cyborg/Changeling/Starfire

[shevek]

The Bette Kane character really doesn't fit with the modern Batwoman

When they introduced her as the original Batwoman's side kick it was mostly as a comic relief and a puppy madly in love with the original Robin

than they reintroduced her when the Teen Titans had 40 members, this was pre Raven/Cyborg/Changeling/Starfire

Bette had more lives than that.

She was Flamebird in the later period of the New Teen Titans, wanting to become a costume because she idolized Robin.

Then later on, Bette was established as Kate Kane's cousin and entered the modern Batwoman mythos, eventually changing her name to "Hawkfire".

Just saying, she has been integral to the Batwoman comics run and could easily be incorporated into the show.

[Visitor]

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/bat ... 41327.html

Picked up for the full season of episodes and currently has the most viewers for a CW show.

[Maskripper]

Can hardly describe ....HOW...excited I am about it (the Batwoman part)!
Perhaps somehow like this:


-
And I found exclusive footage which is showing one of the many trolls after he heard that Batwoman has a full season now:

Spoiler

Guess he melted into a blubbering puddle....

(put that gif in spoilers so it wouldn't be visiable all the time...)

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More:
https://batwoman.tv/batwoman-receives-full-season-order
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[Dogfish]

The thing with the bat grapple hook thing saving the elevator was pure comic book bunk but if you can't let that sort of thing go you're missing the point of comic books. When you fire a grappling hook in a comic book it hits something and it stays fixed, that's literally a law of physics in the universe where comic book stuff happens. It's why any given Batman survives longer than a week when in real life if you trusted your big escapes to firing a grappling hook in the air above you seemingly at random the best case scenario is you'd just get hit on the dome by a falling hook, it's why Spiderman doesn't accidentally swing onto something like a window cleaner's bucket, or hell a window cleaner, when he's bopping through the city. Comic book universes are built out of grappling hooks.

As for the 'plot hole' of there not being any security outside the office in a dude's 49th-ish floor penthouse during a party, I mean, why? Do people seriously think rich people walk around flanked by goons all the time. The whole point of living on the 49th floor is you can stick the goons on the ground floor and let your rich pals have the run of the place. He's a real estate douche not the Kingpin.

[shevek]

Well of course, it's all suspension of disbelief anyway. If there aren't any goons guarding his 49th floor penthouse, you'd think there'd at least be some electronic security measures. But whatever..she had to get to the MacGuffin, so she did.

Had no idea that Batwoman wasn't already signed for a full season Glad they're giving it a chance - they'll need lots of Gotham villains to fill the antagonist void, and like I said, I hope they get to Flamebird/Hawkfire. Would also love to see Nocturna (Natalia Mitternacht) as the vampiric villainess who once hypnotized Kate Kane and put her under her spell - that's actually in the comics and would be a real superheroine-in-peril scenario! Another cool female character might be Gotham Girl (Claire Clover, who has super strength that's slowly killing her when she uses it) if they bring her over from the newer Batman Rebirth comic.

[Visitor]

Batsplaining is a thing. Luke gets to take second place on getting good lines.

Meanwhile Alice is still the best part of the show. Playing Katherine Hamilton to get what she wants.

Nice shots of the Chicago River for downtown Gotham.

[Maskripper]

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[GeekyPornCritic]

I tried watching this show last night. I was so bored to death. Watching this show feels like a chore. I don't care about any of the characters. I don't think this show has any potential at this rate.

[Maskripper]

^^
"Bored to death?" ....even with Batwoman VS Magpie?
Wow, an interesting definition..... of "boring".
Then keep watching porn.

[GeekyPornCritic]

I tried watching this show last night. I was so bored to death. Watching this show feels like a chore. I don't care about any of the characters. I don't think this show has any potential at this rate.

Bored to death? ....even with Batwoman VS Magpie?
Wow, an interesting definition..... of "boring".
Then keep watching porn.

Not every person has the same opinions. I think the fight was very boring. It was lame. There was not anything special about it.